AJM

If one more person tells me to complain Ill complain about the harrasment to complain. Or worse bop em on the nose.

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Complainering,

Make a written report to the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA), which is the body that oversees the TV industry as per my previous email you go to their website, download the relevant form, fill it out and send it to them.

You do not have to make a complaint to MAA first. Because captioning is a licence condition, you can make a complaint directly to ACMA without first going through the process of writing to the station and waiting for a reply. You will need to put your complaint in the form of a letter (or you can print out ACMA’s complaint form) and mail it to them.

This is what Chris Mikul from MAA has instructed Deafies to do.

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I learnt that if I am not happy with captioning I should complain. I learnt that if I complain I have to make ure its not a reception problem. I learnt that if its a reception problem and others are having the very same reception problem I should complain. I learnt that if I complain and nothing happens I should complain to ACMA. I learnt that if I complain to ACMA and nothing happens I should go to AAD of Deafness Forum and ask them to complain. I learnt that after all this if nothing improves I should complain. Complainering is good.

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Ballarat beat Melbourne. Ha!

What did you and others think of MAA seminar?

What did you learn?

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The Rat rocks!!!!!

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Debbie - we had 20 or so people at the Media Access info session. Some people drove from Horsham. Good night all up. We beat Melbourne's record of 4 people!!

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Dean

What a mess. In regards top getting dunds one would have thought that the CEO of DSA, some say who is nothing more than a glorified clerk, should have found the money from the government.

What has he been doing. Does he really care?

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Emmanuel/Let Me Play,

Once again I can empathise with Emmanuel's concern. I suspect DSA hasn't realised the issues that need to be addressed. In addition, by involving NZ as part of the "AUSTRALIAN" Deaf Games creates another layer of issues too.

"Let Me Play", I dont think Emmanuel was stating that NSW cannot partake in the ADG, but more so how the rules complies with current ADG Rules that are govern by DSA (and I should add was ratified by the members at the time).

Im sure he wants to see NSW people involved but it is more the point of how will the point system work.

On the DSA website it states that the ADG is promoted as "..the pinnacle of sports events for deaf and hard of hearing people is the Australian Deaf Games." And that "..the ADG comprises State team competitions across the fifteen sports approved by Deaf Sports Australia (DSA)."

It further promotes "..state rivalray..".

This 'state rivalry' forms part (or perhaps the backbone) of the reason why it has been told (and reinforced and stressed) by DSA that to partkae in the ADG you MUST be a current financial member of your State Deaf Sports Organisation.

However the lines (ie the rules) has become increasingly blurred of late and rather than just wanting to take part in sport, the cost issue now plays another role and just what the incentives are in this regards to the partcipitants.

The ADG should be the breeding rgound for talent identifciation as well as providing a sense of belonging for those Deaf and hearing impaired Australians to stand alongside those with similar challenges and aspirations.

The removal of individual sports from the ADG such as athletics (which provides an array of opportunties than the likes of swimming) now creates less opportunities for 'first timers'. In addition, with the increasing number of sports being scratched, the ADG appears to become more of a 'team sport' focus than both team and individuals.

The perception is that unless you are within the Deaf community or already playing with other Deaf people in your chosen team sport, the chances of a first time deaf participitants being 'spotted' and then 'strutt your stuff / show your talent' are increasingly slim.

Access to the ADG should be the highest priorty in order to get as many active deaf people involved and enjoy their sport.

BUT, for DSA to impose variable (and what some say confusing) fees and then invite a international competitors (I support this initiative however it is not the right time to do it) creates a different kettle of fish in terms of what the ADG is really about.

Whilst my aim here is not to diminish the efforts of the ADG Organisations who are all based in Brisbane, however I do question how and why DSA has allowed this event to proceed despite what appears to be little to no financial (both monetary and non-monetary) backing from local, state and Fedaeral Governments in order to reduce entry cost in this regards.

If the Government were fair dinkum in regards to reducing child obesity, mental health (ie isolation, deperession), grass roots participiations and their so called (and multi million dollar) " After School Activities" then they would (and should) be actively backing this event without the usual red tape that comes with the Govt package.

A mere $1m-$2m from Govt sources (perhaps Dollar for dollar contributions from Local, State and Federal Govt - dont forget they will get most of the money back from our tourism dollar!) will go a long way to reduce competitors cost and ensure high attendance and quality Games rather than a stressful, financially struggling and "bit of here and there" Games with restricted outcomes.

As for NZ being involved, dont get me wrong, I support the idea of inviting our ANZAC friends HOWEVER, the ADG (as well as DSA) need to get the framework right and have a solid base before taking massive leaps like this. One even suspects that inviting NZ will assist in addingt he numbers to beat Sydney Deaf Games record. Trying to be all things at once creates headaches and the question should be just what is DSA really trying to achieve?

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Emmanuel

I really don't care.... I just want to play and be involved. The Australian Deaf Games are dying infront of our very eyes. To argue about stupid eligibility rules is crazy... we just wanna compete and have fun.

More to the point the fee structure is killing the games. Before people could play lots of different sports and this sometimes was the difference between having a team and not having one. Now if they want to play more than one sport they could be paying up to 400 dollars for rego.

The ADG always was about taking part. Ok DSA need to make it more cost effective but I think the fee sructure is a step in the wrong direction. I believe it will kill the games and what a sad day that will be.

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Hi everyone

Just received from a friend DSA latest's newsletter. Nothing new. They didnt answer about how NSW deaf people will be eligible to compete at ADG when there is no NSW Deaf Sports Association!

Wonder if NSW people will get a rude shock when after they pay registartion they find out they are not eligible to win points for deaf shields.

I agree with Dean's view. Need to be fair with all states.

Also their webiste very old and out of date. Looks like 2007 an exciting year eh?

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Thanks again Bobbie for the latest update in regards to RMIT.

One question I need to ask:

Is VCOD aware of involved in this issue and whatabout the likes such Deaf Children Australian AND VicDeaf? Isnt this something they could assist with in educating (or re-educating) RMIT personell about their intended approach?

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Jacob,

Check AJM’s reply to captioning problems that was posted on May 4th.

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RMIT jobs threatened

May 14, 2007

Dozens of RMIT staff face the sack as part of a contentious plan to outsource jobs that help disabled students at the university.

In a move that could result in more than 40 casual and full-time staff members losing their jobs, the university has proposed outsourcing all note-taking and Auslan interpreting roles from its disability liaison unit.

University chiefs have claimed the change will save about $98,000 a year. But staff say it will cost about $400,000 in redundancy payments - and slash services.

Jeanette Pierce, the RMIT branch president for the National Tertiary Education Union, said staff who are at risk of losing their jobs provide students with an average of 440 interpreting hours a week, and 400 hours of note-taking.

"RMIT has a well-deserved reputation for providing excellent support to students with disabilities, and as a result it has a large number of students requiring services," she said.

"This reputation will be in jeopardy if the proposal proceeds."

An RMIT spokesman said outsourcing the university's disability support services was an attempt to increase flexibility and improve the services provided to students.

FARRAH TOMAZIN

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Reminder that Media Access is in Ballarat tomorrow night - Wednesday 16th... come and make yourself heard.

Marnie

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Since I have posted up about these DVD captioning earlier this year or late last year, not sure if i could recall.. I have a question for you all, relating to the TV programmes, like Channel Ten and Channel Seven.

"Have you ever get frustrated if you find that subtitles displaying on the screen is blinking and you miss out everything from the show you are watching, like for example, your favourite show?"

I have experieced this since, this has been happening, and I have been frustrated last night from Channel Ten TV shows, due to these blinking subtitles, the subtitles just blink and disappear, displaying absoleutely NOTHING. I have emailed to the Australian Caption Centre to file my complaint on this, but I am not sure if I am doing the right thing.

THE captioning on TV programs NEEDS to be FIXED.

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Since I have posted up about these DVD captioning earlier this year or late last year, not sure if i could recall.. I have a question for you all, relating to the TV programmes, like Channel Ten and Channel Seven.

"Have you ever get frustrated if you find that subtitles displaying on the screen is blinking and you miss out everything from the show you are watching, like for example, your favourite show?"

I have experieced this since, this has been happening, and I have been frustrated last night from Channel Ten TV shows, due to these blinking subtitles, the subtitles just blink and disappear, displaying absoleutely NOTHING. I have emailed to the Australian Caption Centre to file my complaint on this, but I am not sure if I am doing the right thing.

THE captioning on TV programs NEEDS to be FIXED.

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Its election time .. Wee hooooo time to get a few nice goodies into the basket for deafies. Make a noise ...everyone will hear it ...the pollies ... the public ... the media ... everyone will hear our cries of GIVE ... except us that is .... being deaf and all (bad joke, sorry)

Who will make the noise. A few disgruntled souls on these pages. The cheeky elitist scum that make up The Rebuttal or our Deaf organisations. At the moment it seems its no-one.

A few choice emails have come across the desk at the announcement of the budget... Our CEOs are jumping up and down with excitment about a few little tidbits in the budget. Lots of backslapping goes on. The CEOs come out as one ... The catchphrases roll of the tongue ... 'we are very pleased .. We got an extra hundred grand for awareness ...' 'Fantastic news, there's a few thousand in the budget for new born hearing screening.'

Everything is thank you, gratitude and sucking up to the govt. We don't want to upset them do we. We need to continue to give the government the illusion that we are forever in their debt.

If deafies miss out on anything in the budget the CEOs inevitably say something like this ..'Unfortunately we missed out on getting a committment to improve Deaf Education .. We are hopeful this need will be met in the next budget..'

If you ask the CEOs why they don't make more noise about the things they missed out on they will tell you ... 'We are working towards it ....' or they will say ...'We would rather not say anything at this stage lest we put the government offside...' or 'The government are our funder, we do not wish to embarrass them in public, we will continue to work behind the scenes ....' or worse they say ' Deafness is seen as a very small fish by politicians, we need to be very sensitive with what we do ...' Tell me .. Are you beginning to feel patronised .. What twaddle.

Meanwhile while our Deaf organisations do a perfect portrayal of a grateful puppy Deaf kids are still leaving school with reading ages of around 8 years old. Meanwhile after 21 if your hearing aid breaks and you need a new one you will need to take out a loan unless you earn above the national average wage by around twenty grand. Meanwhile Deaf people continue to missout on employment opportunities while having to accept Mickey Mouse programmes like the AFE ...

Make a noise not a whimper I say. Enough of this sucking up to the Government and pollies. Howards a Coward ... Rudds a Dud .... lets get a chant going ... Whatever you do ..... MAKE A BLOODY NOISE .. Enough of this softly softly approach ..Its not working .... progress is too slow!!!!!!

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Thanks for this Bobbie. It is always good to hear what is happening in other states especially given I live in Victoria and did not know anything about this!.

This is very disconcerting to say the least. You have to wonder whether the Education industry has ever learnt from the many failed attempts by them to discriminate people (citing trivial reasons) with a disability let alone deaf people.

If the DDA is still sound then RMIT can not (or should not) proceed with their initial proposal.

In addition the recent signing of the UN Treaty in March should also give some weight as well. Keep us informed Bobbie. D/deaf Victorians - Unite!

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Thanks for this Bobbie. It is always good to hear what is happening in other states especially given I live in Victoria and did not know anything about this!.

This is very disconcerting to say the least. You have to wonder whether the Education industry has ever learnt from the many failed attempts by them to discriminate people (citing trivial reasons) with a disability let alone deaf people.

If the DDA is still sound then RMIT can not (or should not) proceed with their initial proposal.

In addition the recent signing of the UN Treaty in March should also give some weight as well. Keep us informed Bobbie. D/deaf Victorians - Unite!

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I'm bringing to your attention a move by RMIT which has the potential to affect everyone planning or currently undertaking, university studies. The following article is extracted from Australian News, Green Left Weekly issue #708 9 May 2007.

RMIT plans to disable students

Sarah Jane Miles & Atsuko Nagami, Melbourne

4 May 2007

RMIT university is proposing to sack note-takers and Auslan (Australian sign language interpreters currently working at its Disability Liaison Unit (DLU), replacing them with contracted staff from outside RMIT to “save” a mere $98,000 a year.

At least 45 jobs, most of which are held by RMIT students, will be slashed if this move goes ahead. RMIT has acknowledged the plan is driven not by any shortcomings in the DLU’s service, but simply by a desire to cut costs.

RMIT has said that there is currently no means in place to monitor the quality of the services, which leaves no guarantee of the ability to monitor quality if the services, including management of students’ confidential files, are handled by contracted staff. This change could endanger a support system relied heavily upon by many students.

The current note-takers and Auslan interpreters, some of whom have 8-15 of experience, have demonstrated long-standing familiarity with academic requirements in an extensive number of programs.

All students and staff at RMIT would be affected by a reduced level of support for students with disabilities. One in three people will suffer from a disability at some point in their lives.

There has been an estimated 80% increase in students accessing the DLU with mental illness, as well as a plethora of other disabilities, such as learning impairments, physical and intellectual disabilities and acquired brain injuries.

Currently, the proposal is being scrutinised for potential breaches of both the Workplace Relations Act and the Disability Discrimination Act (1992).

Eighty students and staff gathered outside vice chancellor Margaret Gardner’s office on April 26 to protest against RMIT proposal. Ten pages of signed petitions were slid under the VC’s door.

An open public meeting on the issue has been planned for May 16. An invitation to Gardner to speak has not yet been accepted.

If you would like to get involved in the campaign against RMIT’s attack on the DLU, weekly campaign collective meetings are being held on Mondays at 5pm. Building 8, Level 3, Meeting Room C, RMIT. There is disabled access.

For more information email Emily Fishman, RMIT student welfare officer, at studentunion.welfare@rmit.edu.au.

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I'm bringing to your attention a move by RMIT which has the potential to affect everyone planning or currently undertaking, university studies. The following article is extracted from Australian News, Green Left Weekly issue #708 9 May 2007.

RMIT plans to disable students

Sarah Jane Miles & Atsuko Nagami, Melbourne

4 May 2007

RMIT university is proposing to sack note-takers and Auslan (Australian sign language interpreters currently working at its Disability Liaison Unit (DLU), replacing them with contracted staff from outside RMIT to “save” a mere $98,000 a year.

At least 45 jobs, most of which are held by RMIT students, will be slashed if this move goes ahead. RMIT has acknowledged the plan is driven not by any shortcomings in the DLU’s service, but simply by a desire to cut costs.

RMIT has said that there is currently no means in place to monitor the quality of the services, which leaves no guarantee of the ability to monitor quality if the services, including management of students’ confidential files, are handled by contracted staff. This change could endanger a support system relied heavily upon by many students.

The current note-takers and Auslan interpreters, some of whom have 8-15 of experience, have demonstrated long-standing familiarity with academic requirements in an extensive number of programs.

All students and staff at RMIT would be affected by a reduced level of support for students with disabilities. One in three people will suffer from a disability at some point in their lives.

There has been an estimated 80% increase in students accessing the DLU with mental illness, as well as a plethora of other disabilities, such as learning impairments, physical and intellectual disabilities and acquired brain injuries.

Currently, the proposal is being scrutinised for potential breaches of both the Workplace Relations Act and the Disability Discrimination Act (1992).

Eighty students and staff gathered outside vice chancellor Margaret Gardner’s office on April 26 to protest against RMIT proposal. Ten pages of signed petitions were slid under the VC’s door.

An open public meeting on the issue has been planned for May 16. An invitation to Gardner to speak has not yet been accepted.

If you would like to get involved in the campaign against RMIT’s attack on the DLU, weekly campaign collective meetings are being held on Mondays at 5pm. Building 8, Level 3, Meeting Room C, RMIT. There is disabled access.

For more information email Emily Fishman, RMIT student welfare officer, at studentunion.welfare@rmit.edu.au.

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Thanks for your comments Tim/AJM,

Tim, I agree with you. I am continously mystified as to why there hasnt been school awareness projects that build on the work that was kick started by M2005. Deaf sports plays a vital 'cog' in deaf people's lives (let alone able bodied).

AJM, Great minds think alike. Would you belive that 12 follow up letters has been made to Senator Brandis including CC to my local Federal MP, a couple of other Federal MP and also the opposition and Rudd. Now I have taken it further by writing to the Prime Minister seeking an explanation and why such Senators should treat deaf people in this manner.

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Firstly Dean, did you actually expect a politician to take the time to get back to you? Secondly, because he thought you were not important enough to reply to, try writing to the not-so-honorary George Brandis opposition counterpart. Don’t forget to mention the lazy so-and-so didn’t reply!!

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Indeed, it’s very interesting posting Dean.

I do hope that someone from the DSA could shed some light on this issue especially with the Federal budget spending on sports.

I am a SADRA member in which affiliated with the DSA organisation. As Gary says “If these people are lost to hearing sport for ever with no knowledge of Deaf sports it could spell the end of the Australian Deaf Games and Deaf Sport”. I believe this will happen one day. I remember once many years ago there were a group of Deaf teenagers came to me and told me that I was in the Deaflympic Games. I asked them how they know. They said David Morgan from the old ADSF (now DSA) came to school and gave them a presentation of the Deaflympic and Australian Deaf Games. They saw me running in the either final 800m or 1500m from the video.

This vital information such as presentations to schools is really important. I believe the Deaf sports are an important part of the Australian Deaf community. Without the Deaf sports, it will fade away so quickly. Then the AAD will be folded too.

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Emmanuel/others

I took the liberty to do a search within the Federal Budget as well as within the Minister of Sport's Senator Brandis website and currently I see nothing within that budget that relates to Deaf Sports Australia let alone what could be 'exciting' for deaf sports / deaf people in Australia in general.

Im a little disconcertned because there has been a a National Disability Sports Review in which the former CEO of Deaf Sports Australia Dr Jacinta Baldin was the Project Officer (employed by the Australian Sports Commission and has now left and working for the Dept of Human Services (or VicHealth I understand) and is was recentrly appointed as a Non Executive Director of the board for the Special Olympics.)

I contacted Jacinta at the time she was working on the project last year and she persisted that the report was 'confidential' presumably for 'Government Eyes Only'. People can only suspect that THE report is not favourable for deaf Australians.

I understand many people have been in contact with Senator Brandis about the outcome of this national disability review and he has not bothered (one iota) to reply to each of them after many months despite many repeated follow ups.

I myslef have serious concerns as to this review partly because they formed a national advisory boatrd (or reference group) which consisted of people who are viewed as 'experts' on disability related issues yet there was no Deaf person providing expert advice/opinions related to deaf people's needs. Even a very l high profile politican expressed her concerns that the then Minister of Sport should show integrity as to why this panel was formed without an experienced deaf person on board.

In fact it can be said the panel consited predominately of people who have a close affiliation with those who have a physical and/or mentall disability.

I can now appreciate Emmamuel's point how 2007 can be exciting year when we seem to be seeing the 'same old'.

One can only suspect that once again deaf sports has missed out both in the federal budget and the so called 'vertical integration' of disability sports looks likely to go ahead.

I am trying to remain enthused about deaf sports future but with little to no information from DSA and the repeated 'positive future/year' is starting to wane.

No one is talking or wants to talk which is even more disconcerting to say the least. This is not what I had envisioned after advocating for so long for and on the M2005 Deaflympic Games Pty Ltd and how deaf sports should pivot off from the Games itself.

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An Non Ymous

What planet are you from????

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Emmanuel/others

I took the liberty to do a search within the Federal Budget as well as within the Minister of Sport's Senator Brandis website and currently I see nothing within that budget that relates to Deaf Sports Australia let alone what could be 'exciting' for deaf sports / deaf people in Australia in general.

Im a little disconcertned because there has been a a National Disability Sports Review in which the former CEO of Deaf Sports Australia Dr Jacinta Baldin was the Project Officer (employed by the Australian Sports Commission and has now left and working for the Dept of Human Services (or VicHealth I understand) and is was recentrly appointed as a Non Executive Director of the board for the Special Olympics.)

I contacted Jacinta at the time she was working on the project last year and she persisted that the report was 'confidential' presumably for 'Government Eyes Only'. People can only suspect that THE report is not favourable for deaf Australians.

I understand many people have been in contact with Senator Brandis about the outcome of this national disability review and he has not bothered (one iota) to reply to each of them after many months despite many repeated follow ups.

I myslef have serious concerns as to this review partly because they formed a national advisory boatrd (or reference group) which consisted of people who are viewed as 'experts' on disability related issues yet there was no Deaf person providing expert advice/opinions related to deaf people's needs. Even a very l high profile politican expressed her concerns that the then Minister of Sport should show integrity as to why this panel was formed without an experienced deaf person on board.

In fact it can be said the panel consited predominately of people who have a close affiliation with those who have a physical and/or mentall disability.

I can now appreciate Emmamuel's point how 2007 can be exciting year when we seem to be seeing the 'same old'.

One can only suspect that once again deaf sports has missed out both in the federal budget and the so called 'vertical integration' of disability sports looks likely to go ahead.

I am trying to remain enthused about deaf sports future but with little to no information from DSA and the repeated 'positive future/year' is starting to wane.

No one is talking or wants to talk which is disconcerting to say the least. This is not what I had envisioned after advocating for so long for and on the Mq005 Deaflympic Games Pty Ltd.

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A Deaf organisation has $500 000 to spend...

Peter... I've heard those options that you listed earlier this week... a particular organisation have thought about these things, or have acted on it - with various success.

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If their football team has anything to go by, then 2007 sure as heck won’t be exciting. Predictable perhaps, but certainly not exciting!

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Ummm... Gary and Tim have a point about deaf sports and deaf society.

But DSA said 2007 is to be an exciting year. Im still waiting to be excited!

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I have to agree with Gary's posting. CanDo4Kids have an excellent website with a list of services.

But with the sporting programs, I'd like to see Deaf people to involve with the Deaf children somehow.

Cheers

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Disillusioned ....

To be fair to Townsend House I think a lot of the early SAIL mentor programmes were pretty disjointed too.

I am not sure when you worked for them but in the early days it took a little fine tuning to get the balance right

There were not a lot of programmes to use as models and some of the early programmes we designed fell over a bit.

I would hope by now the model would be a lot stronger. But even with some of the early difficulties it was obvious it was a very powerful tool when done well.

I have seen what Cando/Townsend have done with the mentor programme on their website. I have to say it looks excellent.

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Adam, I too worked with the mentoring program, but it was run by Townsend House however I was totally disillusioned with it so I left. There was no structure, goals or expectations of what the outcomes were to be. I know this is different to the one run by SAIL, but I don’t see the need to have two separate mentoring programs (if there still are)

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Oh gee Gary, you made me laugh!!!

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A very thought provoking posting Tim.

As you advised I took the liberty of checking the Cando website. I was most interested because I wanted to see what they had done with $300 000 that was once the SAIL programme.

The fight for that money was somewhat legendary. It went on for many years. I once also had the privilege of working on the mentor program that was established by SAIL and in partnership with what was then known only as Townsend House. As I understand it SAIL focused on youth whilst Townsend House focused on younger age groups.

I was greatly heartened to see that the mentor programme still exists. In fact it would seem to have expanded and improved. However, its basic principle appears to remain the same, life skilling.

I was somewhat saddened that in the mentor section of the website there was no recognition of the people that had worked tirelessly to set up the mentor programme. I think that we sometimes do forget important people and forget to give credit where it is due.

I am aware, for example, that Paul Creedon who worked tirelessly for deaf and hearing impaired people for many years, first allocated funds for the SAIL project in 1999.

Paul was then instrumental in having the government allocate extra funding to the project under what was then called "Unmet Needs Funding" .. I believe this was $285 000 in 2000. We must never forget his input.

Then there was Gary Kerridge who developed the foundations of SAIL. He along with Alex Crawford at Townsend House developed the mentor concept that is now used and universally respected. These two pioneers developed the training package for mentors, the guidelines for mentors, recruited the intial intake of mentors and continually refined the mentor programme.

When Mr Creedon secured the $285 000 dollars this funding was used to expand the SAIL concept of mentoring to Blind and vision impaired people. Mr Simon Wong, himself vision impaired, was instrumental in this development.

Then of course there were Jane Nelson and Debra Swann. Fantastic workers in their own right that further established the SAIl mentor model. Today Jane remains associated with the mentor programme. There is also Tracy Schrippa ... Did you know she was the first ever mentor on the programme .. she now also works for Cando.

There is a lot of history in this mentor programme, which I believe is among the best in the world. I am really pleased that Can do have continued its legacy and even improved it. However let us give credit where credit is due. It would be good if Cando could put a short history of the programme on their website that acknowledged the work of the many people that made the programme what it is today.

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Hi Tim

Your posting is interesting. If Deaf sports and recreation comes under Deaf societies or Deaf oprganisations I hope they still give Deaf people control over what happens.

It worries me that some of these organisations have a strong integration philosophy. This is ok but they forget that putting a Deaf person amongst a lot of hearing people can be very isolating and lonely. It can take a bit more than just having a support person there.

For example they could provide interpreters or Auslan classes for the sports groups so that the Deaf person can integrate better and not just take them along to games and think playing is enough.

This is not so far fetched. When i worked for SAIL we had a client who was into surf life saving. We paid for someone to go to the club and teach people to sign. we had about ten who came everyweek. It was good awareness raising and helped the client to get involved more.

Its important that the Deaf community remain involved and in control in someway. Through these hearing sporting events they can identify young people that might want to take part in Deaf sports teams. These people will be the future of the Australian Deaf Games, take part in the Deaflympics and so on.

If these people are lost to hearing sport for ever with no knowledge of Deaf sports it could spell the end of the Australian Deaf Games and Deaf Sport. That would be very sad.

I think it would be good for Deaf organisations, especially mega rich ones like Cando, to support sport participation but the Deaf community needs to be closely involved and in control.

Deaf sporting groups and DSA need to recognise this trend and jump on board. These young kids are the future of the community.

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I got beefs too.....

Mate

take your story to the editors of "The Rebuttal" They are waiting for good stories

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Hey guys,

I have a prediction that within the next ten years. All Deaf societies in Australia will be controlling all the Deaf sporting clubs/associations. Looks what happened to the NSW Deaf Society. In SA, DoCan4Kids has a service providing to the Deaf children to involve with the hearing sporting clubs. If you are not sure, have a read at their website. It's seems to be that both DSA and SADRA have missed the important service. I am pretty sure that one day they will be taking over the SADRA management, who know?

I don't know what's the plan is going to be.

Cheers!

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Hey why we pick on DeafSA ... Qld got issues too ... Our CEO not even live here. Who has stories about other states.

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Some of us should start writing the history of DEAFSA. To my knowledge nothing is written yet.

Books were written on Winds of change from Brisbane, No longer by Gaslight from Melbourne are good examples.

Anyone want to start? Hands up for a great story of the Century!

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Yes. They put it in the Rewind store before being bankrupted.

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Oh yes that bloody can opener ... they sold it in the secondhand shop and couldn't afford another.

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The tin of worms hasn't been opened yet. But where is the tin opener!

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Just thought of a chapter title for the book Gary, “They came, they saw, they blew it”

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They could do with the money from the book sales! Then again they would probably blow that on something worthless and unnecessary…………..

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Anonymous .. It certainly was .. Someone should write a book about it .. The DeafSA Story ... It would be so unbelievable that noone would buy it!

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I was a board member of DeafSA. If that the case, then it should be a gross misconduct for not being recorded in the minutes.

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Peter and David, let us not forget the big kudos they spent (blew?) on setting up an irrelevant and unnecessary hearing service even though the Australian Hearing Service operates thoughout SA and Australia.

That’s innovative thinking……………………not!

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Three members of the board management gave the OK to the old DeafSA of CEO to set up businesses for quick bucks without the full board approval. Most of the expensive spending items weren't recorded in the meeting minutes and wasn't given the full board approval. There was a serious code of conduct that the same three board members gave the approval of pay rise for the CEO of DeafSA as the businesses he set up have failed. This wasn't recorded in the meeting mintues. I have confirmed that someone has the hard fact to prove it.

The question is why Kevin Jolly as a chairman of the DeafSA at the time is currently on the management board of the Townsend House?

He should be resigned by now as all objectives he set and approved during the past meetings with the CEO of the DeafSA and his little friends of board members have failed. It's a disgraceful!

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My guess would be Deaf Children Australia... building an undercover car parking and plus take over the whole of Australia... correct me if I'm wrong!

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Sorry David ... Those answers were not options .. At anyrate probably your answers were far to sharp and intellectual to be those of our CEOs ;-)

If it was DeafSA the CEO would be open up a third secondhand clothing shop even though the first two went broke!!

Apologies to Paul Flynn who was not responsible for the mess that was made.

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Thinking like a CEO? Hmm, I’d give myself a pay rise, then after that I’d give myself another one. Do I win?

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Peter,

Whatever you do, don’t ask anyone from DeafSA to answer this!!!!!

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I will donate $50 to your favourite charity if you can answer the following question correctly!

A Deaf organisation has $500 000 to spend. They have a sound investment portfolio already. Should they spend this money on:

1) Taking over Australia

2) Study tours overseas

3) Building an undercover car-park

4) Developing leadership opportunities for deaf people

5)Prize money for a raffle

6) Grants to enable deaf people to achieve their dreams.

Only two answers are correct. The trick is you must think like our current CEO's ... Which will you pick.

Good Luck!!

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OOPS

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Dear Rebuttal Team--- can you please reply to me, with your bios as I requested a week or so ago....

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Make a written report to the Australian Communications and Media Authority, which is the body that oversees the TV industry as per my previous email. Don’t try writing to Channel Nine personally because they will more than likely fob you off with some dismal excuse.

http://www.acma.gov.au/WEB/STANDARD//pc=PC_90141>

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Unhappy Deaf Viewer

I always tend to be a little more tolerant of live captioning. It is prone to human error. I am embarrassed to say I actually watched some of the Logies .. How sad .. At least its not as bad as my wife who reads TV Week from cover to cover when she goes shopping cos she is to embarrassed to be seen buying it!!

But anyway there were times when last nights captioning was pretty good. Then it would go off and some of the clips were not captioned. Or suddenly the captioner would wake up .. And type frantically to catch up with the dialogue.

I wonder if any one knows why this happens with live captioning. The spelling and mis-typed words are always a great source of mirth but the lack of captioning, or the the captions coming on well after the speaking has started are another thing.

Is this technical or human error. It would be good to understand why this happens.

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And now for the unwanted award for:

"Im not going to provide 100% quality captioning during a live telecast for Deaf and Hearing Impaired Australians. Tough titties!" go to"

Channel Nine's Logie's Award Night 2007!

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Not at University level Daniel.

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Hi, I'm from Colombia and I arrived to Adelaide Friday 25 April. I need to Know If here Have a Studies for Deaf People like Gallaudet In Usa?

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AJM

Many thanks for this. Very interesting.

I do have a couple of people I know very well in a senior capacity within ACMA and may pay them a call to see if they can assist in someway to ensure our issues are addressed seriously (and hopefully quickly).

I think all TV stations have had plenty of opprtunities to address our ongoing concerns but it is now time to start going above their heads and seek action.

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To all,

I received a reply from Chris Mikul who is the Project Manager at Media Access Australia about the captioning problems on Channel 10. Below is his reply.

‘I'm writing about the complaint you made to Channel 10 made via our website. The problems with their captions stem from a change they made to the way they broadcast their programs available in high definition (identified as ‘HD’ in most program guides) several weeks ago. It affects some set-top boxes more than others, but as you say, many people are experiencing problems. Ten assured us that they would have this fixed last week, but needless to say they haven’t.

We are now advising people that they should make a complaint directly to ACMA (the Australian Communications and Media Authority), which is the body that oversees the TV industry. The complaints section of their website is here:

http://www.acma.gov.au/WEB/STANDARD//pc=PC_90141>

Note that, because captioning is a licence condition, you can make a complaint directly to ACMA without first going through the process of writing to the station and waiting for a reply. You will need to put your complaint in the form of a letter (or you can print out ACMA’s complaint form) and mail it to them.’

Please note this is the same for any network (7, 9, 10, ABC, SBS). The only way we can get this mob to get their act together is to write directly to Australian Communications and Media Authority which is a Federal Government department.

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Ok so DSA made a mess of things. Deaf sports all over Australia are facing challenges. All that matters to me is the sport and the friendships that come from ADG.

I am sure many like me don't give a rats arse for the politics. As a NSW participant I want to play and compete in the spirit of the ggames. As far as DSA constitution goes well .. Who cares ... The games come first.

I propose that this year we just drop and forgwet the need to be a member of the state body. Get to Queensland, participate, have fun and may the best team win.

Lets make it about the Games and Deaf people. Lets sort out the political crap later.

Sure DSA should have done better .. I don't care I want a successful ADG, I want to have fun, meet the girl of my dreams and enjoy the games in the memory of all our Deaf sports pioneers..

It is sad atletics is gone this time. Yes DSA messed up bad on that. Lets make the games a success and make sure athletics is back next time. Make it about sport and Deaf people again not money.

Get back to basics and get Deaf peopple running DSA again.

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I have been inundated from people seeking my thoughts and comments in regards to the recent posting on this page about DSA and the Australian Deaf Games. They also seek what would I have done if I was leading this national peak deaf sporting body?

Clearly there are quite a few unhappy deaf people across Australia about what has transpired over the past few months.

I have taken the liberty to review previous posting and considered the comments within and offer my personal thoughts on this matter:

1) Regarding the ADG rule that participants are to be a financial member of a State Deaf Sports Association and the current non-existence of a NSW Deaf Sports Association:

Response: I can appreciate why people are mystified why it has taken DSA 5 years to act on this and with almost 7 months to go to the ADG that this matter should have been dealt with earlier. I can empathize with these people and as a national peak deaf sporting body, it is understandable why people are questioning as to what DSA priorities has been.

Given the circumstances, and taken into consideration the new constitution that was ratified by the deaf sports members at the last AGM, I would suggest as a compromise that as a ‘one off’ situation, all NSW participants who register via the NSW Deaf Society should partake in the ADG, HOWEVER, in fairness of other state deaf sporting organisations and that there is not official NSW Deaf sporting body that is currently a financial corporate member of DSA, any results arising from a NSW participants would not incur points towards the overall shields.

Reason for this is that all state deaf sports organisations will experience good and bad times but respecting to the DSA constitution and history of this event, that fairness need to be considered in the spirit of the ADG and to not discourage (or punish) interested NSW deaf people from partaking at these Games due to what some say is result of incompetence of a certain few.

But rules are rules (especially when it has been ratified by the ‘true’ members of DSA) and need to be respected in fairness. Otherwise we could set a precedent for others to follow which could be destabilizing in the future. In addition DSA would be seen as creating one rule for them and another for others.

Therefore NSW participants can still receive medals but the ‘points’ will be void in fairness of other states. I can appreciate that this may not be the best option, especially why this matter was not sorted earlier, but clearly it is a matter that DSA need to seriously address at future ADG.

Don’t get me wrong. I fully support active participation and that we should not discriminate other states or deaf persons. However, it needs to be reminded that there are valid reason why organisations become financial members of DSA and the benefits/privileges arising from such. Therefore I would expect DSA to respect those state deaf sports organisations as given higher preferences for ‘adhering to the rules of the ADG’ than those who haven’t.

2) In regards to DSA decision to ‘terminate’ some sports including athletics from the ADG:

I must admit that I am a bit biased here because of my long involvement in Athletics and how beneficial this sport (as well as swimming) has been not only for the ADG but also to enhance Australia’s reputation with the rest of the deaf sporting world due to our success at previous Deaflympic Games.

I am quite personally (and extremely) disappointed with the decision that DSA has taken as it appears to be done without forethoughts or the impact that it will have on a sport such as athletics especially when the current role models have served honourably for many years and not to mention how often DSA tries to captilised the success of these athletes to their advantage.

I can also understand and appreciate the confusion people have when DSA publicly indicate that that ““2007 is upon us, and what an exciting year it promises to be!” And their so called workshops titled "Deaf Sports - Count Me In!" when in fact it has terminated (or counted them out) a long serving and respected sport such as athletics despite stating that it has ‘consulted’ intensively before making a decision.

I took the liberty to make some enquiries including our current Deaflympians (as well as medalist), Athletics Australia, Life members etc to determine the facts and compare to what DSA has communicated (i.e. it reasons) to the public and all I can say is that the information that has been shared to me appears to differs significantly from what DSA seem so be communicating to its members.

Furthermore, the recent posting by the President of DSA further adds weight to my findings that if DSA has come to a decision to terminate various sports citing potential lack of numbers, finance etc and that they ‘consulted’ on this matter, I find it quite strange that they made this decision despite considering the NSW ‘affiliation’ issue.

In my view it appears they have “..shot the horse before it bolted.” Or come to a decision before determining ALL the facts and possibilities. Therefore I can appreciate why people feel it is laughable that DSA states it is ‘an exciting year’ and to promote involvement in deaf sport when it facts it has done the opposite and created barriers.

3) DSA Leadership and their role with ADG

People have shared with me their ongoing concerns about DSA’s real role and passive leadership in light of the successful Melbourne 2005 Deaflympic Games. In addition whether DSA is ‘out of touch’ with regards to the needs and expectations of future ADGs and Deaf sports.

With almost 7 months away from the 2008 ADG, I see no point in trying to diminish the enormous efforts undertaken by the existing 2008 ADG GOC who are all based in Brisbane. I’m sure they are working with significant challenges despite a short time frame and with some conservative support and funding. Having Founding, Chaired and later overseen the M2005 Deaflympic Games Pty Ltd, I have considerable empathy what the current Chairperson (or Chairwoman) and her local team is going through.

I suspect that DSA is gradually realizing the warning signs and advice that was communicated to them as far back as 2002 and that they are now experiencing far greater challenges (or mountains) than what should not have occurred had they heeded these messages.

My personal view is that DSA is still ‘green’ and has a lot to learn in order to really lead the way. They have a number of short comings and their priorities differs from mine in that it appears they are operating on a short term focus rather than really establishing strong foundations and really build on the success of the M2005 Deaflympic Games. I am, frankly and honestly, not confident (yet) that DSA has ‘..the right people on the bus..’ to take them to the next level but we have to just work with what we have for now. But changes will need to be made to ensure the deaf sports and deaf Australians wishing to partake within the sport and recreation industry are able to enjoy themselves fully on equal terms as other mainstream Australians.

I do believe there is still a place for deaf sports in Australia but to really grow and bloom requires radical intervention and bold initiatives. The landscape and sporting industry has changed considerably and hence we need to adapt ourselves or miss out altogether. It is really up to the Deaf and hard of hearing sporting community to tell DSA what they REALLY expect and ensure DSA delivers for our current and future deaf Australians.

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Hey all I want to do is take part in the games. Who cares about the constitution and what people should have done 5 years ago.

The Games are in danger of dying ... they must come first. Participation is everythin. Drop the silly arguments and make the Games live. They die and a big part of the Deaf community goes with them.

We owe it to the future and our Deaf sport pioneers to make it happen. Put down your knives and work together.

I do think though that DSA need a Deaf CEO. I don't think the hearing CEO really appreciates the history and culture that go with the Games. Shoew faith I Deaf people .. Make DSA Deaf again.

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Sounds like they are being influenced by the hearing people. They want this kind of service, hence more grant money for them. It's all about the power struggle.

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Emmanuel is right. I checked. No one in NSW is afiliated with NSW Deaf Sports because we dont have one! No membership for many years.

Me wonder. How can DSA allow NSW Deaf Society to look after NSW deaf sport people when there has been no membership arranged for many years?

I wonder. Is NSW Deaf Society now an corporate/financial member of DSA as per their new consitution?

Did DSA consult with other State Deaf Sports Assocications (who are financial members) to seek their support to allow NSW people to register with NSWDS?

It has been 5 years since NSW Deaf Spport collaspe now NSW get lucky to join up?

How did DSA come to the decision to drop three sports from the ADG early this year due to 'low numbers' and saying it was not worth it but appears DSA havent worked out how many from NSW will compete?

Or was DSA many thousands in debts from last AGM the reason to drop three sports and athletics from the ADG so to cover DSA cost? Is this fair?

Something doesnt smell right here.

Brett/DSA, please explain. Is this fair?

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Emmanuel,

Thank you for your postings expressing your concerns regarding Deaf Sports Australia.

Since I don't know who you are, and that you reside in Victoria, I would very much like to meet you Emmanuel. I invite you to email me at brent.phillips@deafsports.org.au and we can see if we can meet up and have a chat about your concerns.

For those of you residing in NSW and participating in the Australian Deaf Games, DSA has been making significant inroads. I delivered a "Deaf Sports - Count Me In!" workshop in Sydney in March and will be delivering another workshop in Lismore next month. These workshops are aimed at skilling deaf people to confidently participate in committees and run meetings. It is hoped that a group of motivated people will establish a deaf sports organisation in NSW eventually with the full support of DSA.

Emmanuel's email is very timely. I am pleased to say that DSA has entered into a partnership with the Deaf Society of New South Wales where the Deaf Society will assist in the promotion and coordination of the 2008 Australian Deaf Games registrations for residents of NSW and ACT. This is part of DSA's long-term strategy to re-establish deaf sports in NSW. A release along with detailed information for NSW participants will be sent shortly.

Emmanuel, I look forward to your email and the opportunity to meet you.

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I did too, and I sent a strong worded complaint to MAA.

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For those of you who watch ‘House’, were the captions totally all over the place last night, or was it just me?

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Yeah Tone .. he is clearly not a chardonnay drinker.

;-)

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Dean

Just watching Channel 9 is enough to spoilt that lovely glass of Shiraz!

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Hey everyone. Got more interesting facts for you.

Did you know to compete at ADG, you have to be a member of a State Deaf Sports Association which is a rule that DSA follow for many, many years.

NSW Deaf Sports collasped around 2002-2003 so does that mean every NSW deaf person will not be eligible to compete at the ADG?

Or will we see a last minute arrangement where NSW Deaf sports is quickly formed just for the ADG and then collaspe again afterwards? Is this fair to other State Deaf Sports Associations or should there be a certain time frame that a state deaf association must be running actively before members can be eligible to compete at ADG?

How can DSA terminate at least three sports (including athletics) if they havent 'consulted' with key sports properly?

I dont agree it is Deaf community fault because DSA Board had opportunity to really work from M2005 Games but seems they rather fly around attending social events/conferences. When was last time DSA visited all schools around Aust (money better spent) and also met with Hardof hearing organisations? Many have not met or heard of DSA. Big market missed.

Not happy DSA.

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Guess what - had to submit another complaint via MAA re A Current Affair last night. This time it was worse.

I concur with Kat, AJM and Gary. We appear to be getting responses base on the 'symptoms' rather than the 'cause'. The old recption/tunning excuse appears highly questionable now due to the following:

a) I watch Channel Nine News at 6.00pm (with a glass of lovely shiraz) and captions were perfect however at 6.30pm I am watching A Current Affair and the captioning are shocking (which spoiled my glass of shiraz). During ad breaks captions are good then I watch Tempation and captioning is good so how can it be a 'reception/tuning problem' in this instance?

b) If other people are experience similar problems with the quality of captionings and they are based either interstate and in remote areas, surely this is a matter that goes beyond the "recpetion/tuning' problem if other people are experienicng the same.

c) If our TV can recieve quality picture and sound, how can it not recieve the same quality captions? Why are these products continually being sold if it cannot recieve captions effectively?

d) Kat is spot on, if a hearing person experience poor quality picture or sound you can be the station will drop everything and get it fixed pronto? Why because it also has an impact on their advertising dollar and those who spend $$$$$$$$ to get a spot on TV. They dont want to lose further advertising revenue in this respect. However when captions issues are raised we dont get the same immediate reaction.

e) Some TV stations undertake 'digital' upgrades knowing true well that it will occur during 'our captioning time' (ie 6pm-11pm) but don't do some modifciation outside of these hours. I think this is a blatant disregard to people like us who really appreciate the value of text communication and we should not have to endure such ignorance.

f) Last year I spent around $75 to get my reception on TV fixed and captioning was fine. Should I have to call "Mr Antannae" (disclaimer: no cash for comments here) everytime I get told there "I" have a 'reception/tuning' problem? Can you imagine how costly it will be to keep calling Mr Antannae evertime I'm told of this? We makes me think, is it appropriate for TV stations to tell me I have to fork out at least $75 service fee (plus the additional cost to buy specific text based equipment so I can have equal access to every other hearing TV viewers in Australia wheresas they dont). At times it can be as much as $600. The DDA indicates that I should have the same equal access as every other person so is it right that I should have to endure such financial burden or should I simply forward the bill to the TV stations to pay up?

Further to this we get specific support when it comes to accessing the telephone netwrok so how is it different to accessing the media network?

g) If TV stations were really fair dinkum and values the growing Deaf and Hearing Impaired/Hoh market (at least 4 million plus) perhaps they should consider developing a toip of the range captioning device (which eliminates reception / tuning problems) and provide it to any person who needs it. The upside here is that they get a far greater reach of 'untapped' market which increases the number of people watching various shows, advertisers will be happy and they will get less compalints in the future. A small price to pay (these TV guys earns millions a year and boast about it) for a long term benefit.

Food for thought

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I take note as to what Ben said ... I have issued a guide as to complain nicely.

1) To DEWR ... I Love you .. U gave us a lot of money for the AFE ... Thank you very much .. It was really nice of you .. I was touched that you would think of us all ... It brought tears to my eyes ... BUT .. Its no good .. Can you please do better next time .. Pretty please!! ....

2) For captions ... Thankyou too all the TV people for putting captions on for us all. Such genorisuty cannot go without praise. All those words that you put on tyhe screen for our benefit. Goodness it must be so expensive for you .. And you ask nothing in return .. It is fabulous ... Thanks SOOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH!! BUT ... Its no good, I sometimes cant read the words ... But having said that I know you make the mistakes with my best interest at heart, bless you. You even make me laugh some times with totally bizarre captions ... On Dancing with the Stars last night you captioned Breast cancer as .. I think it was .. snapplebopper certificate ... You rascals you. You love to test my powers of intepretation dont you. Please do better .. After a long day at work my powers of interpretation are not quite up to it .. I know you will do better because your hearts are so big.

There you have it ... Use these examples as a guide for "nice complaining" and you cant go wrong. I wrote this without the slightest bit of sarcasm .. Honest - Oh deary me!!!

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Larry,

What a brilliant idea!! Let us all throw out our nice, new expensive TV sets, Top box sets, DVD players, VHS players (for those who still have them) and cut ourselves off completely from the outside world. That way we can sit around a card table and talk about, ummmm, gee not sure. It is not as though we can talk about what is happening in the world, whether it is sport, current affairs, or who Shane Warne is texting to this time around.

You may think television is boring or silly. You may even think its evil but it is how some people keep in touch with what is happening outside their front door. Television is not only for people who can hear – that is a bit like saying the radio/CD/MP3 is only for blind people.

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Hiya Kats,

Since when did TV Networks take heed on what we say? I wish I could take the credit but alas I can’t. Maybe there is an SBS mole that checks the AAD Discussion Board and reports back to the head honcho :o)

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Caption Crusader - that is precisely my point, hence I have put what you have extracted in italics. I do not know whether they are being moronic or very smart. I suspect the later because they have received numerous of complaints by now and have done little or nothing about it.

But as posted recently about captioning issue, I sense some level of relationship has been damaged because of threatening complaints or ugly complaints as proven here with the AFE matter. This gives TV stations the ultimatum to “toy” with us. Otherwise, they should not be this consistent in toying with us for so long and especially with numerous of complaints.

Remember, I am sensing it which does not mean that I have proven it or thoroughly investigated the issue.

I do suggest for TV stations to forward threatening or ugly complaints to AAD or other relevant deaf/HI organizations so we can inform and teach our fellow deafies/HI to complain nicely without threats or profane nature. Because, the last thing I want to see is for companies or individuals to have an excuse to their negligence and the law allows companies and individuals the right to complain. Remember, “You start it, I finish it” childish attitude still exist in human nature, despite the fact, my professor has emphasized that it is human nature (empirically studied) to not have that attitude.

Still, if it were the case for them to rely on an excuse, it does not give them the right to deprive other fellow deafies/HI from watching their shows. It was just one bad sheep out of all of us and why should all of us suffer the same consequences of that as the one bad sheep?

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AJM

thank you for your trouble and time to put all the addresses of the offending TV stations & the so-called associated advocator on captioning. (do we live in third world country?)

I aim to print these and give to the deafies/HOH to start a barrage of complaints. I am sure other readers of this posting do the same

Here's to me, slogging and earning a hard day's wage. I come home to break a bottle of decent beer in hand, and flick the TV remote on for a well earned reward to watch & READ the captions of the outside world news, documentaries and what have you. Of recent, only to be thrown at my face with farcy farce captions thank you very much to the offending tv stations!

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Dear AJM

cc Alex

What do you know now??? Surprisingly tonight's SBS station screen is crisp. Did you say something to it? We had that smattering digit screen for the last 7 days perhaps after the deluge SBS went funny. We live in the northern suburbs.

All stations including ABC are crisp clear with captions and nothing to do with poor tuning or reception. As Gary said before get the MAA and the respective stations to take responsibility to sort the farcy farce poor captioning performance in place.

Most Deafies are seasoned viewers of teletext and would know the difference between bad tuning and poor reception.

Imagine if voices on tv stations crackle intermittmently and who would be totally annoyed & tearing hairs from their heads??? the hearies of course!

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Alex

I know you were only trying to give people the hard facts but MAA is about Media Access - Deaf and hearing impaired people spend thousands on technology and to be denied access because of reception issues sucks. Surely Media Access should have a role of providing solutions to these reception problems.

Rather than the TV stations and MAA telling us "Sorry its a reception problem" .. Give us some solutions to these problems. Its a far more constructive way to deal with this than to just handball it back with a statement that you need a better antenna or better tuning.

Lots of people owe their jobs to Deaf and hearing impaired people needing captions. Lets get some solutions to these reception problems rather than just handballing the problem back to the consumer.

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TV with teletext at hospitals.

for a start fill in a form for in-patient surgery... there is a line for special request section - from private hospitals - FMC, Henley Hospital etc. They usually provide teletext tv for Deaf Patients provided the forms are delivered few days before admittance.

with public hospitals - best to direct to the Hospital TV hirers or Hospital customer relations

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Kats,

Re your message about who to write to in regards to the crappy captioning.

I have emailed Channel 9 and asked them for the persons name so that you can contact them directly along with their name. To make a specific complaint regarding general programming matters direct your complaint in writing to:

The Programming Department

Channel Nine

In Your Local City

NSW Viewers: PO Box 27 Willoughby, NSW 2068

Vic Viewers: PO Box 100 Richmond, Vic 3121

QLD Viewers: PO Box 72 Brisbane, QLD 4001

For Channel 7

PO Box 777

Pyrmont NSW 2009

The link for Channel 10 is http://www.ten.com.au/ten/contact_us.html The Code of Practice sets out a formal complaints process for matters covered by the Code of Practice. But considering their attitude to the CoP the AAD set out I doubt they would give much thought to your letter. Stranger things have happened.

The link for ABC is http://www.abc.net.au/contact/contacttv.htm and it has various email addresses. Good luck with the ABC, after all “It is your ABC”

And last, but not least, we have SBS. This link http://www20.sbs.com.au/sbscorporate/index.php?id=1064 will take you to where you can chuck a wobbly about the captioning.

Good luck!

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Kats,

I have no problems with SBS or ABC. The main villains are 7, 9 and 10. Funnily enough they are the ones with all the money.

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Ben,

When you quoted, “There is nothing that stipulates what quality the captions have to be” that is moronic as the TV Networks can put on whatever they like. If the captions freeze, repeat themselves or whatever else they do all the Networks have to say is, “Hey, we put them on, we don’t give a rats a&*e if they don’t work properly………….”

Pathetic on their part

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Hi Julie,

I’d like to see TV sets with captioning available throughout the hospital system.

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Re: out of sync captions, repetitive dialogue captions

Most Deafies/hard of hearing I know suffer the same consequences that Dean & AJM mentioned in earlier postings. Just don't play "pass the buck" or basket it in the too hard basket. Just please get this sorted once and for all.

If the captions would have missing letters or words, then we know that TV antenna require tuning

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Alex

thanks for that advice re tuning on SBS. of recent SBS is clear in digital screen. just the last 7 days the SBS is playing up. Nothing wrong with the antenna and tuner. All stations via topfield STB are digitally tuned. Crisp reception. Just that SBS itself is playing up. Maybe the glass reception/globe somewhere in Oz is cracked? I have checked with others with similar problems too so it's just not me.

Kats

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Larry,

That’s life. I have equal access as the hearing person and nothing stops me from gaining equal access.

You talk about deaf community being weak; I am not sure about that. It is mainly the laws, made by the Government and how our society perceives us deafies/HI, which makes it difficult for us to fight our rights for equality and deaf awareness. This includes education, captioning, DVDs, accessing products and services. (Some hearings think we are lucky to be driving cars at all, which proves the misunderstanding on their behalf of us deafies/HI)

I do not know the solution to social gathering, except to continue seeing your close deaf friends and wait for big events such like Australian Deaf Games, annual deaf sport championships, reunions etc.

Larry, we all know that hearings make the captions for TVs and it is not us. But, we are complaining about poor captioning on TV shows and how can we fix it for better future.

I hope this helps.

Cheers

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I confuse with on here. You people talk on Deafie commune become weak. Deaf kid not have special school to learn no more just normal hearie school. Deafie socials group all finish. Deafie sports group all quiet. Nothing good for Deafie no more. No socials group to drink to hand talk. It made me sad to think past. Better in past not now for Deafie.

So me confse have why? Cos on computer board you talk of captions television. Tv evil for deaf. Hearie people make to captions not deafie. It bad wrong for us.

I say tv to sleep to do. Turn to off tv to sign lanague with Deaf make commune strong again. Tv for silly hearie pepple not Deafie. Tv same enemy for commune. Tv boring. Stop worry over caption. Boring.

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Please everyone,

If you re-read an earlier posting, there was a letter responded by Chris Mikul, Project Manager for Media Access Australia.

I will highlight the important bit which in return shows how your complaints for captions on free-to-air are being ignored.

“The main problem is that, while there is legislation that says what the free-to-air stations have to caption (all news and current affairs and everything between 6pm and 10.30pm), and there is a separate deal with the Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission that, by the end of this year, they have to caption 70% of 6am to midnight, there is nothing that stipulates what quality the captions have to be. Deafness Forum has formulated caption quality quidelines, which are on their website, but no TV networks have committed to them (though they pay lip service to them).”

(the italics are my emphasis).

Furthermore, “all we can do is encourage people to complain to the stations when they see bad captioning (or no captioning on programs that should be captioned). We've set up a complaint form on our website (http://www.mediaaccess.org.au/) where you can lodge a complaint and it will be forwarded to the relevant station. We get a copy of the complaint too, so it allows us to keep track of ongoing problems.”

So, the problem with our current agreement is that the quality has never been specified but for quantity. TV stations have to supplied the quantity of 70% captioning per day from 6am to 12pm nightly but nothing says about the quality!

So, at the next meeting, it is imperative for Deafness/HI organisations to put the quality of captions on the agreement. If it is the case that TV stations provides the captions as specified on the agreement but not the quality, then I am curious why they are being so mean? Perhaps, they have received lots of complaints with threatening nature or ugly complaints, which in return, allow them to act this way. (This makes sense to me). If someone threatens me or treats me with utmost disrespect, then I would find a way to make it worse for the person, providing I am within my legal limits. And it seems to me, this is what TV stations are doing (holding a grudge against us)!

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Hi everyone,

just wondering if people would like to share their views and comments on public hospitals and the treatment/standard of care Deaf receive? I am really interested in regional areas and Deaf who may be of a different ethnicity than mainstream.

Thanks!

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Hiya Dean,

I too have sent more complaints than I care to remember and it seems those who think they are of higher importance than us (the television networks) never seem to take the time to respond. I have kept all the emails I receive from MAA notifying me that my complaint has been sent to whatever network so that if the Networks come back and say, “We never received your complaint” then I can print them off and shove it in their face.

DF and I are working on something at the moment. I can’t say too much yet but if it works out then it might make the Networks think twice.

Watch this space…………..

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Kats and others,

I am sorry, but if the picture is "digitally fragmented and scattered" then you have a tuning/reception issue. A digital picture, if properly tuned, will be perfect and the captions will appear properly too.

I am the first to say complain if there are problems, but in partial defence of the networks, most of their programming is properly captioned - we monitor it, record it, check it.

There are issues with captions on some programs (particularly live programs) and with some brands of set-top boxes, but if your experience is that nearly every program you watch is poorly captioned/distorted captions, then you have a tuning/reception issue - it simply isn't that bad out there.

Please feel free to contact us by email: info@mediaaccess.org.au or check our website on some tips on how to fix tuning/reception issues.

Alex Varley

Media Access Australia

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dean

well done for your consistently banging on ACMA/MAA.... on erratic captioning especially on TEN news; the SBS is no better - the picture is digitally fragmented & scattered; and loss of real time scenes; the out of sync captions on most stations.

Seems to me the channels are out of control reining the captions loose.

Where is their respect to the Deafies/hard of hearing? We seem to be spending more time lipreading the actors rather than reading the #@*%^# smattering captions.

can someone forward the email addresses\fax\phone or whatever is best to reach the offending stations so we all can send a barrage of complaints

thanks

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AJM

Thanks of ryour response. Much appreciated.

Good of you to enquire with DF on this matter further.

FYI: I have submitted at least 6 forms via the Media Access Australia complaint webpage (plus many others I have sent via email/letters in the past.

In fact I just submitted another complaint via MAA tonight in regards to the out of synch captioning on A Current Affair.

Interesting to note on MAA website stating that Chanell Ten has fixed the captioning problem but from my end it appears to be no changes at all.

Im still writing to ACMA because it is time a federal authority take action on this matter.

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Dean,

I have been in close contact with Nicole Lawder who is the Chief Executive Officer from the Deafness Forum of Australia about this and she has urged me to tell everyone to fill out a complaint form with Media Access Australia (http://www.mediaaccess.org.au/). Nicole and I have been working on a few things to help highlight the dismal and pathetic quality of captioning provided these days and hope to have something worked out soon, so watch this space.

I wouldn’t hold your breathe waiting for those bozos at Channel Ten, nor the Muppets at any other station. As far as they are concerned its YOUR FAULT the captions don’t work. Sure, you might have a new TV, Topbox or picture perfect quality but it’s still your fault according to them.

I have suggested to Nicole about boycotting the annual ‘Captioning Awards’ and while they too have considered it they vetoed the idea due to the fact that there are a number of shows that are captioned reasonably well.

I usually find Channel Seven as one of the worse offenders with captioning repeating itself even though the scene has finished. Along with Channel Nine with its missing captions, or as I call it – Now You See It, Now You Don’t.

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having just watched Henity's America on globel warming i am pleased that there is someone who is prepared to give a balanced report on this subject.here in Aussi all we seem to get are alarmest reports that are biast.their are plenty of qualified scientists around that have different views why are we not given these.what agenda has the media got for not telling the full picture harold

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Well the saga continues.

Ten News continue to deliver less than acceptable quality captioning as witnessed tonight.

Then I switch to Chanell Nine to watch Sixty Minutes and witnessed stagnant captioing, no captioning or captions that have been withheld but shows rapidaly on the screen making it virtually impossible to read. On top of this the words that are being used do not correlate with what is being said.

For a show such as Sixty Minutes, which is not shown 'live', you have to wonder whether there are appropriate checks in place to ensure the quality of captioning are being adeqautely assessed.

I cant get any quality captioing on SBS without my entire screen going blank and with greek letters/hanging captions scattering all over the screen.

Just these three stations, all within a short appears to show a total disregard to the impact that they are doing to people like us.

Oh by the way... still no responses from the various complaints I subitted to Channel Ten in the past.

Hi ho, Hi ho.. it is off to ACMA I go...!

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Celia and Gary,

This is the question I am waiting for a long time. The social structure of the Deaf community has changed slowly since 1880. The language of AUSLAN in Australia in the last 10 years has changed a lot. This is difficult for me to answer the WHY question. This type of issue needs to be studied by a PhD person in linguistics.

I believe that the year 1880 is the trigger of the century that affects the Deaf community’s social structure. During the period of 127 years, it has created so many factors that affect the education, the history and the lives of Deaf people. Those factors are created by the professional people such as hearing teachers for the Deaf, audiologists, doctors, CI, speech pathologists and the likes. The latest factor is obviously the technological.

My strong belief is that the solution to the social problem is the implementation of the video phones in the Australian Deaf community. Because it is the only technological we’ve got and this will benefit us greatly. I am sure that the cost and benefits analysis of video-phones is far outweigh the ‘others’. Deaf clubs in Australia are disappearing and Deaf students gone into the mainstreamed classes with hearing schools. They need Deaf social interactions without having spent so much money to travel to meet each other. These facts are the examples of why we do need video-phones.

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Hey if you could email me please.. would be awesome if you could get back to me tonight but tonorrow or saturday might be more convienient. my email is pickachu127@hotmail.com. if you want to add me to msn and talk that would also be awesome!

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Hey.. my name's kirstin and im hearing impaired. Im studying Auslan at CIT and i was wondering if you could hepl me with an assignment. i need to know how people in the deaf community feel about AAD's services. like have they helped you and when did you need the help and what help was it that you got. All information will remain confidential. Would be great if a few people could help me out. :D

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That, Celia, is a good question. I hope there are some native Auslan users that can answer it ..either Deaf or Codas.

It is worth noting however that one of the primary Deaf studies units in Australia has 4 Deaf staff teaching the linguistics of AUSLAN .... Of these four only one could be classified as a native AUSLAN user.

So as far as social structure change goes, you would need to look a long way back to get an accurate answer.

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Well do you think the social structure of the Deaf community has changed because some grow up in the culture and some become part of the culture later?

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I used to bag cochlear implants but I don't any more. My only issue is cochlear implant professionals still promote it as a cure for deafness, will restore language and literacy, will develop great speech etc when this is not always true. They only trot out the successes, not the failures. If it was a honest promotion of cochlear implants with pros and cons, successes and failures, I would be more forgiving.

I also still have issue with speech pathologists and CI professionals who believe that once someone has a CI, all signing must stop and it must be full aural/oral training despite research proving that signing assists with speech skills.

Also, the deaf facilities or deaf schools, deaf societies etc get dumped with the 'CI failures' and we see the harsh reality of the whole process. The other side of the coin so to speak.

I don't mind CI - as long as full unbiased information is given ( which is hard to achieve) and implantees and families are not pressured to follow the oral / aural communication mode only.

Just waiting for some CI professionals to follow suit.

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Why do people continue to bag cochlear implants

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I won't win too many friends for saying this ...but in the interest if good debate I will.

Part of the problem with VCD, through no fault of their own, is that they are often the dumping ground of Deaf kids with other issues.

Many of the kids that attend VCD, and I suspect a lot of Deaf Facilities, have other issues. They come from low socio economic backgrounds, they have other disabilities such as intellectual disabilities or the come from families where culturally disabilty is viewed as shameful.

What this means is that Deaf schools and Deaf facilities are often made up of problem kids. Because of this teachers often do not push kids enough. They protect them rather than challenge them. Moderate achievement is accepted as the norm because the benchmark is too low. Consequently education standards are low meaning many parents keep their kids away from Deaf schools and facilities.

If professionals could see Deaf schools as a culturally, academically and socially acceptable means of education AND not dump the problem deaf kids on these schools AND refer higher achieving deaf kids to these schools .. We might truly see their real benefit.

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There are both negatives and positives with the decline of large deaf schools.

Firstly, education standards are usually far better in mainstream schools than schools catering for the deaf only today. Schools for the deaf today have a dwindling population, and one that does not foster larger class sizes, mental stimulation, challenges etc that you see in mainstream schools today. Unfortunately deaf student nbrs are small and often the deaf kid is the only one or one of two or three in their grade level. They often have to become friends with that deaf student just because they are there.. not because they like them. It becomes a matter of survival. This is not healthy when you consider hearing kids can pick friends out of 25 students in their class and a deaf kid has no option if their language and social skills lets them down.

But, deaf schools do provide better language and social opportunities. Many older deaf people moan about how sign language has been attacked by hearing teachers of the deaf and signed english and hark back to the good old days where kids could always learn proper Auslan at school. Just a pity about education levels - even now - so many TODs have been in the field for so long they have forgotten what expected education outcomes are and don't push or challenge kids enough. Or they think, too hard.. no point. In a mainstream school the desire to succeed and make kids succeed is stronger as people are watching you. The same scrutiny is not there in deaf schools now.

I could go on for ever but my view is that there are too many deaf facilities per state. Choice is a good thing for families but not at the deaf kids' social expense. If I had my way there would be probably two major deaf facilities at primary and secondary level at Govt school level in a metropolitan area, with the majority of funding going to those schools. This means the deaf / hearing student ratio will be higher. Currently its something like 12 - 15 deaf kids to 250 students if you're lucky. No real social and language experiences or a chance to choose deaf friends. I would prefer to see at minimum 30:70 or 40:60 ratio deaf kids to hearing. This allows for better social and language experiences plus offering better access to education.

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Just ask the respective state education departments for the disappearance of large Deaf Schools.

Just ask the Doctors of Cochlear Implanters for the declining Deaf population.

Then you will have answers

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I am wondering if anyone would like to share their views with me in relation to the disapperance of large deaf schools and how this is affecting the Deaf community.

Thanks

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Mike,

Gary brought you the hard core facts. And in fact, it is not new. Some of the teachers knew about this. Why?

I can't give you the specific information of my old friends as Deaf people back in Adelaide will know who. I remembered the good and fun times during the old school days in recess and lunch breaks with them. Because we had a fun gathering and have the same common sense, although we don't sign. I am the only one that sent to high school with Deaf students where they used the Signed English as a teaching and communicating methods. Others have gone to mainstreamed hearing schools. During the high school days, I was asked to attend the Deaf club because I was very good at sports. So I went to the Deaf club one golden Friday night, I remembered every minute of it, their signing are different to what I was taught in Signed English. It made my eyes wide opened. From there, I went uphill and was seeing my old friends once or twice every year since the 1980's. As I can see their development have changing them since and it's quite sad. Facts about them are from the reliable source, sorry, I can’t reveal them.

I was very fortunate to be involved in sports, otherwise I won't be writing in the AAD forum discussion pages, perhaps being isolated from hearing and deaf worlds.

The most important question I mentioned previously, which needs to be answered is why parents don’t often speak out the failure of their well-speaking deaf children. Not just bad English skills as Mike says, this is so crap.

Cheers!

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Mike

There are some valid points in what you say, however, Tim is close to the mark.

Research abounds that shows that Deaf and people with a hearing loss have greater mental health problems than the general populace. Some figures even claim it is up to 50% more.

The factors Tim points out such as poor English and poor language have a big impact. It impacts on ability to study and also to work. This impacts on self esteem.

The ability to speak well does not always mean socialisation is better. We all know what it is like to be isolated within a big group of hearing people. It can be stressful, it's isolating and often demoralising. The inability to "overhear" what others are saying also impacts on the individuals social learning and maturity as it is through this interaction that much of this develops.

Most people born deaf and who speak well are educated in the mainstream ..83% is one figure often quoted. There is a misconception that because they speak well they interact well. It is a burden that many born deaf individuals do not cope well with. Particularly as a large proportion of this 83% dont have any other deaf role models to learn from.

There are many factors indeed and like you said many deaf people dont end up with mental health issues. But the figures are out there that show that the percentage of Deaf and hearing impaired people with mental health issues is higher. Many of these reasons can be linked to what Tim mentioned.

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Tim,

Can you categorically attribute their mental breakdown to their earlier primary school teaching? Between primary school and however old they are now a lot can happen in life and blaming their “Oralisation” (this is a word I just made up, so don’t quote me on i